1 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:13,920 When I'm sitting next to the director 2 00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:17,039 and we're watching the piece of music up 3 00:00:17,039 --> 00:00:19,439 against the screen and we're watching it 4 00:00:19,439 --> 00:00:21,039 together, he doesn't have to say 5 00:00:21,039 --> 00:00:23,039 anything to me. You know, I I I'm 6 00:00:23,039 --> 00:00:26,000 usually the first one to go, "Yes, I 7 00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:28,160 know it's completely wrong and I know 8 00:00:28,160 --> 00:00:32,399 what to do." And what was interesting 9 00:00:32,399 --> 00:00:34,160 for instance when I was working on 10 00:00:34,160 --> 00:00:35,840 Batman Begins in in the sort of 11 00:00:35,840 --> 00:00:38,559 collaboration between James Newton 12 00:00:38,559 --> 00:00:40,960 Howard, myself and Chris Nolan because I 13 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:44,480 I I was watching 14 00:00:44,480 --> 00:00:46,320 you know sort of slightly out of body 15 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:48,640 experience or you know I was watching 16 00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:50,719 how tough it is on the director to 17 00:00:50,719 --> 00:00:52,800 actually go and he knows how hard you 18 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:55,120 worked on it and he doesn't he you know 19 00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:57,680 he doesn't want to go and be rude about 20 00:00:57,680 --> 00:00:59,600 it or whatever but If it doesn't work, 21 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:01,760 it doesn't work. And it's very hard to 22 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:04,640 have to look somebody in the eye and go, 23 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:06,720 I know you sweated bullets over this 24 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:08,720 thing, but it's just not working for me. 25 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:11,520 It's tough. And so, when it was the 26 00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:13,360 three of us, when it was James, Chris, 27 00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:16,479 and I, you know, if there was some if 28 00:01:16,479 --> 00:01:20,000 there was something that um Chris didn't 29 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,600 like about an approach or or if if there 30 00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:25,680 was a better idea to be had or whatever, 31 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:27,759 it was a conversation. He didn't have to 32 00:01:27,759 --> 00:01:29,439 just look me straight in the eye because 33 00:01:29,439 --> 00:01:31,200 as I'm going, "Oh my god, what am I 34 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:32,640 going to do?" James also really coming 35 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:34,400 up with, you know, hey, what about if we 36 00:01:34,400 --> 00:01:38,400 do this and try this? So, 37 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,040 the revisions are just about getting it 38 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:44,159 to be better. Well, and and better isn't 39 00:01:44,159 --> 00:01:46,320 necessarily the quality of the music, 40 00:01:46,320 --> 00:01:49,200 but it's understanding what we're trying 41 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:52,320 to say in this scene and just getting 42 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:56,280 better at executing it. 43 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:02,240 The first revision really happens as I 44 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:04,399 write this musical diary, which is just 45 00:02:04,399 --> 00:02:07,360 my way of figuring myself into the 46 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:09,360 story, into the material, into the 47 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:12,160 director's brain, into the style we're 48 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:13,920 going to be presenting this thing in. 49 00:02:13,920 --> 00:02:16,879 And it's really me learning the movie. 50 00:02:16,879 --> 00:02:19,120 So there is a revision process that goes 51 00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:20,720 on all the time. Even though I don't go 52 00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:23,920 backwards, as I move forwards, I'm, you 53 00:02:23,920 --> 00:02:26,319 know, revising my aim. I mean, I'm 54 00:02:26,319 --> 00:02:29,120 getting more precise about what it is, 55 00:02:29,120 --> 00:02:31,040 you know, what the thing itself is that 56 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:32,879 I'm trying to say. And music is 57 00:02:32,879 --> 00:02:34,800 indefensible in a funny way. I mean, one 58 00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:37,519 of the pro one of the problems with 59 00:02:37,519 --> 00:02:40,239 music is it's indefensible. You cannot 60 00:02:40,239 --> 00:02:43,120 argue about music. You either like it or 61 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:45,360 you don't. It either moves you or it 62 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:49,599 doesn't. But um so sometimes you know if 63 00:02:49,599 --> 00:02:52,319 it literally becomes doesn't do anything 64 00:02:52,319 --> 00:02:55,280 for me great okay chuck it out start 65 00:02:55,280 --> 00:02:58,239 again um but usually by the time I play 66 00:02:58,239 --> 00:03:01,680 something to a director um I know why 67 00:03:01,680 --> 00:03:04,560 those notes are there just 68 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:07,040 as he knows why that scene is there or 69 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:09,040 why that shot is there or why the camera 70 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:12,000 is is at a certain angle and why this is 71 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:14,080 a night scene as opposed to some 72 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:15,599 breakfast scene even though the light 73 00:03:15,599 --> 00:03:17,680 would have been better at 5:00 in the 74 00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:20,720 morning, etc. But we 75 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:23,599 we sort of intellectually can defend the 76 00:03:23,599 --> 00:03:25,680 thing. The only thing we can't do is I I 77 00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:27,840 I will never be able to talk you into 78 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:30,640 liking a certain piece of music and I 79 00:03:30,640 --> 00:03:32,799 will not ever attempt it. I because I 80 00:03:32,799 --> 00:03:36,000 just what's the point? What's the point, 81 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:38,400 you know? Um 82 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:40,640 and then it's just things we discover 83 00:03:40,640 --> 00:03:42,239 together, you know? Oh, hang on a 84 00:03:42,239 --> 00:03:45,360 second. If if we moved this if we moved 85 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:47,440 the whole queue down 20 ft I mean that 86 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:49,040 was the Terry Malik thing we would go 87 00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:52,080 and that journey to the line piece which 88 00:03:52,080 --> 00:03:53,840 is 89 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:55,760 is it 7 minutes long something like that 90 00:03:55,760 --> 00:03:58,640 it's pretty it's it's lengthy we spend 91 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:01,439 all day moving it by one frame later 92 00:04:01,439 --> 00:04:03,680 watching it 93 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:06,720 moving it two frames earlier watching it 94 00:04:06,720 --> 00:04:10,080 you know I mean uh 95 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:11,840 we knew the piece was good and we knew 96 00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:14,879 the film almost good. It's just it's all 97 00:04:14,879 --> 00:04:16,320 a bit like, you know, you're sitting 98 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:19,919 there under an apple tree in the middle 99 00:04:19,919 --> 00:04:21,600 of summer and you're just holding your 100 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:24,639 hand out and just that apple just drops 101 00:04:24,639 --> 00:04:26,320 off the tree right into your hand. I 102 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:28,400 mean, that's how you want the music in 103 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:30,880 the scene to work. And it's not always 104 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:34,639 that easy, but the So, the revisions are 105 00:04:34,639 --> 00:04:38,199 happening constantly. 106 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:43,759 I can't remember what movie it was on, 107 00:04:43,759 --> 00:04:47,360 but I was secretly quite proud of a 108 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:51,600 little Qite written and I came outside 109 00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:54,960 my studio and Harry Gregson Williams was 110 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:56,880 walking down the hallway and I said, 111 00:04:56,880 --> 00:04:58,400 "Hey, Harry, can I just play you 112 00:04:58,400 --> 00:05:01,360 something?" Thinking 113 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:04,000 this, you know, showing off, right? This 114 00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:05,759 is always 115 00:05:05,759 --> 00:05:07,840 where it always goes wrong. So pray 116 00:05:07,840 --> 00:05:09,199 Harry this thing. I'm going what do you 117 00:05:09,199 --> 00:05:12,960 think? He goes oh hands Hansel as he 118 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:15,680 calls me that is so not worth worthy of 119 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:18,400 you you know and and you go okay 120 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:21,440 revision you know might want to go and 121 00:05:21,440 --> 00:05:24,639 and and listen to somebody who has my 122 00:05:24,639 --> 00:05:27,440 best interest at heart. 123 00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:31,120 Seriously it's it's look you and me 124 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:33,120 we're having a bit of a chat here. I you 125 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:35,520 can ask me anything you want and I will 126 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:36,960 tell you anything. I'll talk about 127 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:40,000 anything. But when it comes to playing a 128 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:42,800 piece of music, I become very very 129 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:45,600 fragile because it's sort of, 130 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:47,440 you know, I keep describing it as its 131 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:49,120 own autonomous language and all that 132 00:05:49,120 --> 00:05:51,039 stuff. Well, that there's a downside to 133 00:05:51,039 --> 00:05:55,120 that. I feel you can absolutely and 134 00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:57,199 completely 135 00:05:57,199 --> 00:05:59,199 figure out who I am when I play you this 136 00:05:59,199 --> 00:06:00,639 piece of music. It's the most personal 137 00:06:00,639 --> 00:06:05,199 and private thing I can do. So before I 138 00:06:05,199 --> 00:06:07,680 unleash it on the director and I never 139 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:09,199 look at them when I play it to them for 140 00:06:09,199 --> 00:06:10,639 the first time just in case there's like 141 00:06:10,639 --> 00:06:12,639 a shadow of disdain running across their 142 00:06:12,639 --> 00:06:16,080 face. I play it to to my music editor 143 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:19,360 because you know I work with a Bob Adam 144 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:22,639 for god I don't know we're very very 145 00:06:22,639 --> 00:06:24,880 old. The two of us together probably 146 00:06:24,880 --> 00:06:28,000 yeah we are more than a century. um you 147 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:31,280 know, Alex Gibson, um Melissa Mu, these 148 00:06:31,280 --> 00:06:34,400 are all people that I, you know, I trust 149 00:06:34,400 --> 00:06:36,880 with more than my life cuz that's what 150 00:06:36,880 --> 00:06:39,120 it feels like because when you when you 151 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:41,680 play that piece of music, 152 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:44,080 like you can't [ __ ] you know, 153 00:06:44,080 --> 00:06:49,280 that's this is it moment of truth. And I 154 00:06:49,280 --> 00:06:50,560 don't want to I don't want to hear any 155 00:06:50,560 --> 00:06:52,400 great praise, etc. and they they know 156 00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:54,240 exactly how to react and because I just 157 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:56,080 ask them, you know, and it's very 158 00:06:56,080 --> 00:06:58,560 simple. It's very binary. I go, "Is it 159 00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:02,080 [ __ ] or is it not [ __ ] If it's not 160 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:06,199 [ __ ] we can play it." 161 00:07:10,319 --> 00:07:12,479 With the the great directors I get to 162 00:07:12,479 --> 00:07:15,440 work with, they 163 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:17,360 they they don't even go, "Oh, yeah, this 164 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:19,120 is good or this is bad." or they they 165 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:21,039 instantly go into okay well this is 166 00:07:21,039 --> 00:07:22,960 great and you know this can it triggers 167 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:25,120 a whole set of conversation and ideas 168 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:27,360 and where we can go and take it because 169 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:30,319 of course I lie to them. I pretend, you 170 00:07:30,319 --> 00:07:32,319 know, it just came to me suddenly and it 171 00:07:32,319 --> 00:07:33,919 took me 10 minutes to do when I was 172 00:07:33,919 --> 00:07:36,400 really sweating for six weeks, you know, 173 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:39,199 and um going through, you know, panic 174 00:07:39,199 --> 00:07:42,720 attacks and everything else. Um so, so 175 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:47,199 they know, you know, they they know 176 00:07:47,199 --> 00:07:48,880 they know I'm fragile and they'll 177 00:07:48,880 --> 00:07:51,120 respect that. Yeah. I remember Chris 178 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:52,800 Nolan once saying to me with a piece 179 00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:54,639 that I I didn't really believe in 180 00:07:54,639 --> 00:07:56,800 either, going, "Well, maybe that should 181 00:07:56,800 --> 00:07:58,639 be for another movie." I'm going, "Yeah, 182 00:07:58,639 --> 00:08:00,240 I know exactly what you mean. Let's spin 183 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:02,400 it." You know, it's a very gentle, you 184 00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:04,800 know, a gentle way of telling telling me 185 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:08,319 it wasn't, you know, and and I mean, 186 00:08:08,319 --> 00:08:10,000 that's that's part of it where, you 187 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:11,759 know, we're we're fragile when we do 188 00:08:11,759 --> 00:08:14,080 this stuff. And so, 189 00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:16,800 I remember one one of the first 190 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:18,240 directors I ever worked with, you know, 191 00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:20,080 when I was doing small independent films 192 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:22,240 in England, he was just really rude to 193 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:24,960 me all the time before I had even 194 00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:26,479 written anything. So, I hadn't I hadn't 195 00:08:26,479 --> 00:08:29,280 made a mistake yet. I finally said to 196 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:31,759 him, you know, why are you being so 197 00:08:31,759 --> 00:08:33,519 grumpy all the time with me? And he 198 00:08:33,519 --> 00:08:35,200 goes, "Well, I just want you to know 199 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:37,279 where you're at. That when I hear that 200 00:08:37,279 --> 00:08:39,599 piece of music and I say it's great, I 201 00:08:39,599 --> 00:08:41,519 really mean it and I really tell you the 202 00:08:41,519 --> 00:08:44,080 truth." And really, honestly, that's 203 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:45,760 what you want. I mean, I've I've had a 204 00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:47,920 situation where a director would tell 205 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:50,800 me, "Oh, it's just marvelous, darling. 206 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:52,080 It's just the best thing I've ever 207 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:54,959 heard. It's just so great. It saved my 208 00:08:54,959 --> 00:08:57,760 the line. I am not making this up. You 209 00:08:57,760 --> 00:09:01,200 saved my movie except and then he 210 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:03,920 started digging into it and it it 211 00:09:03,920 --> 00:09:05,920 carried on digging into it until we 212 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:08,399 basically got to the truth which was he 213 00:09:08,399 --> 00:09:10,640 preferred the temp and temp was written 214 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:13,519 by me. So it wasn't like he wasn't even 215 00:09:13,519 --> 00:09:15,839 saying somebody else was better. He was 216 00:09:15,839 --> 00:09:18,560 being in a peculiar way more insulting 217 00:09:18,560 --> 00:09:21,760 by saying I used to be good. But somehow 218 00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:23,839 you know your job is you just figure out 219 00:09:23,839 --> 00:09:25,760 figure out what the idea is and you you 220 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:27,680 know you phone your director and go hey 221 00:09:27,680 --> 00:09:29,040 look I have an idea what if we 222 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:30,640 approached it from a completely 223 00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:33,440 different angle or something like that. 224 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:35,760 It's your job to figure out how to fix 225 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:40,640 it. You know you broke it you fix it.